300 Haley’s Sisters
/Transcript
Full shownotes: https://www.adopteeson.com/listen/300
Haley Radke: [00:00:00] This podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Nothing stated on it, either by its hosts or any guests, is to be construed as psychological, medical, or legal advice.
You're listening to Adoptees On, the podcast where adoptees discuss the adoption experience. I'm Haley Radke. I didn't really think that I'd reach this milestone, but it's here. We have reached our 300th episode, and I've been thinking about this for months and was trying to decide what special interview, what special topic, what could I bring you to mark this milestone?
And I finally decided. that I wanted to celebrate with my sisters. I found my paternal side of my family 14 years ago, and I discovered I had three younger [00:01:00] siblings. So even though I'm technically the only adoptee on today's show, I thought that you'd enjoy this peek behind the curtain, exploring what it was like for my young sisters when they were told at age nine and 12 that they had a surprise older sister.
We deep dive what reunion was like for them, the ups, the downs, what things are like for us now. We also have a brother. He was 14 when we first met, and now he is a very busy young husband and father. And when I spoke about this recording with him, we had his blessing. And I think he shares some of the same sentiments that our sisters are going to share with us today.
Before we get started, I want to personally invite you to join our Patreon adoptee community today over on adopteeson.com/community, which helps support you and also the show to support more adoptees around the world. Oh my gosh. Come meet my sisters. Let's listen in.[00:02:00]
I'm so pleased to introduce to my listeners. My sisters, Amy and Sarah. Hello, girls.
Sarah: Hello.
Amy: Hello, everyone.
Haley Radke: I should say, okay, Amy. Who's Amy?
Amy: I am Amy, and Sarah and I have been told we sound really similar, so it might sound like we're the same person talking.
Haley Radke: Oh, no. Okay, and Sarah,
Sarah: Hi, this is me We do speak very similarly, but I think I don't know I think you'll be able to tell.
Haley Radke: I think so. I think so. That's so funny. I don't hear it maybe I should I don't know. I love people's voices. I'm obsessed with sound so you know, that's the reason for my job. Thanks for being on. You guys are not adopted, but you have some in depth expertise into my [00:03:00] adoption reunion situation, which I thought folks might be interested in to celebrate 300 episodes.
So welcome. Thanks for being brave. The only other relative who's been on the show. Is your mother.
Amy: Oh, yeah. That's right. I do remember when mom was on the show.
Haley Radke: Do you?
Amy: Yeah. I do. I remember. I listened to her episode.
Haley Radke: Sarah, did you listen?
Sarah: I think I listened, but it was forever ago. I don't remember at all. Like, how that went or what the conversation was. Zero memory.
Haley Radke: Yeah, it's been a long time. Speaking of, okay. So we've been in reunion for 14 years as of the time of this recording, which is pretty amazing. Sarah, you were nine. Amy, you were 12. And so we've already passed the mark where [00:04:00] I've been in your life more than not over the halfway point. Do you remember that it was that long? Do you have a clear delineation of before Haley and after Haley?
Amy: I do, for sure. It was, yeah, I think really already a pivotal time in my life, right? I was 12, almost a teenager, and so I have a really clear pre Haley, post Haley memory in my life. It was like, oh, and I have three siblings, not two. So yeah, it was a really big deal. Definitely a significant life event in my childhood.
Haley Radke: When I called our brother to tell him we were doing this, he said, yeah, what I remember is we sat down to dinner and all of a sudden there was a secret surprise sister. Sarah, do you remember that?
Sarah: I [00:05:00] absolutely remember that, and I think, I don't remember the dinner itself, but I vividly remember after dinner that mom or dad had been like, we have something to tell you, and I remember a long pause, and dad looking the most nervous I have probably ever seen him. He is a very clear speaker, he always has something to say, and it was a little of him trying to get the words out and fumbling almost before saying it, I very much remember that very clearly.
Amy: Oh my gosh, that's crazy you remember that so clearly. I don't remember the actual moment they told us.
Sarah: Yeah.
Amy: I actually don't, I remember after and my, I was feeling so surprised and I remember that, but your memory is so clear for [00:06:00] the fact that.
Sarah: Yeah it was such a thing of I don't have a lot of memories across all my life of Dad being frazzled. He was nervous and frazzled to tell us this news, and so I think it was so out of the ordinary that I just very much remember he was super nervous to have that conversation.
Haley Radke: So you don't remember that, Amy, but what do you remember about that time?
Amy: I remember I was feeling really upset after because as I don't know if your listeners would know but we grew up in a very Christian kind of environment and so for me having premarital sex was like the worst thing you could possibly do and so I was just shocked to hear that my dad had a baby outside of marriage when he was super young and [00:07:00] so that was really earth shattering for me as a 12 year old.
Haley Radke: Totally. It's like the person I thought I knew is no more, right? Cause you have this picture of who your parents are and yeah, totally shattering. Yeah. So I remember that your neighbor's dog was named Haley. And so I felt really offended by that because that was the first Haley in your life was a dog Haley but guess what I think that dog is dead so I win.
Sarah: That is correct.
Amy: And I don't even remember that as my first Haley just so you know, you're the first Haley I don't even think about the dog.
Sarah: I remember the dog sorry, Haley.
Haley Radke: Was it a boy dog or a girl dog?
Amy: It was a boy.
Sarah: It was a boy! And they, the only reason they had named the dog [00:08:00] Haley was because they let their eight year old daughter name the dog, who was like a year younger than me. So it was probably, she probably named him when she was like, six and she wanted the boy dog to be named Haley. So they were like, okay, I guess we're doing that.
Haley Radke: Oh my gosh, that's amazing. Okay, I remember sitting down to write you guys emails because that was our first communication. Do you remember emailing me? Do you remember anything that I sent you or what you sent back?
Amy: I remember all the emails. I was so excited to email you. It was the best thing. I remember checking my emails to see if Haley responded.
Oh my god!
Haley Radke: I'm showing Amy a Full, single space typed. This is the first email you sent me. It is a full page.
Amy: Oh my gosh.
Haley Radke: Yeah, [00:09:00] this has got to be 500 words.
Amy: Yeah, and so I remember feeling, I think, so special because here was this adult who, how old were you when we met? 27?
Haley Radke: Yeah, 27, 28. Yeah.
Amy: 27! And I just thought you were so cool, and you wanted to talk to me, and hear about my life, and you cared about who my friends were and what I like to do, and so I felt so special. And I remember we met you not that long before my 13th birthday, and you bought me this necklace.
Which I still have. It's very wait, I'll go get it.
Haley Radke: What? I don't remember.
Sarah: That was sweet.
Haley Radke: I don't remember that.
Amy: Yeah, you bought me this necklace.
Haley Radke: Oh my gosh.
Amy: And I remember you wrote me this note, and you were like, oh this lady hand makes this jewelry, and each piece is unique
Sarah: Aww!
Amy: And I think that's like us as humans because God makes each of us unique [00:10:00] and you wrote this to me and see I remember it so you I yeah, I just felt so special and so loved.
Haley Radke: Good job past Haley. Wow, that's pretty good.
Sarah: I love that. I think my experience was so different because I was so young, right? That as a nine year old, I don't have a very vivid before and after of you, and I really do not remember a lot from emails. I barely even remember emails. I could not tell you a single thing that either of us said.
I think at the beginning of reunion, I was just so excited. I was confused as to why there were big feelings about it, right? I was that young that [00:11:00] I did not understand what a complex situation it was. I was just like, yay! I have a bonus big sister! That's so exciting. And I think when we maybe did a first video call with you and Nick, it had been screenshotted or something.
Somehow I had a picture of you and I remember showing the picture to my friends and being like, guess what? I have a like older big sister. And that was it. And I know that there was a lot of intentionality on your end building relationship, right? And starting to write emails and us emailing back and forth, which really, I think I was just so ready and happy to accept and be like, yay! This is fantastic! And that was [00:12:00] really it. I don't remember a whole lot of early years whatsoever.
Haley Radke: I think that's really lovely for me to think about how for Isaiah, he doesn't know any different. You guys were always in our lives when he was born, and I love that. For you, Sarah, like you don't really remember before Haley too much.
It's not this big delineation, not that there's anything wrong with that, but that's a special thing for you being so young in it. And I do remember waiting for emails. getting back. Amy, I don't know if you remember this, but you did like a full photo tour of the house before we ever visited. Like I have a full, oh yeah, from the the house you lived in when we first met. I have a full photo tour.
Amy: Oh my gosh. I don't even remember that. Wow.
Haley Radke: Yep. Yep. So y'all spent time doing that. [00:13:00] There's a lot of pictures of the dog. Not dog Haley, but your dog. Do you remember? Do you remember when we first met? Did you feel like there was an instant connection? Or do you feel like it took more time to build. I remember Sarah basically sitting in my lap the whole weekend wanting to snuggle up, which was really cute.
Sarah: Yeah, I think I felt like there was an instant connection. And I was just like, great, this is my big sister. And that was really it. For, my small brain, that's as far as I got with any of the details, was just like, okay, this is my big sister, and I was super happy and excited about it.
Amy: I think for me, it was different because I had been so used to emailing with you, and I felt so connected to you over email, and then I met you in person, and all of a sudden, the sound of your voice is really new for me, and the way [00:14:00] you speak is really new for me, and so it was almost like a switch.
I was so excited to meet you, and then I was like, wait, this is different than the person I was emailing. It was like putting the two together, right? Not that you acted any differently, but I wasn't used to you as a full human. I had just had a pen pal almost.
Haley Radke: It's like love is blind. Like we met in the pods and you're talking and then you meet after and it's oh, it's a person with a body and they're not like I pictured. And
Amy: Yes, we had to go to phase two of the experiment.
Haley Radke: Yeah. Of the experiment.
Sarah: Yeah, so true. I think something I remember from meeting in person for the first time was that I was more awkward around Nick than I was with you. Because I think, as a young girl, it was so much easier to be comfortable around women than it was men and [00:15:00] so it definitely took more time to be like, okay, also she comes with a husband and that's great, but also who is he? What's, what's the vibe and what is our relationship gonna look like? That definitely took more time to build, I think, than it did with you.
Haley Radke: Yeah, okay. You probably won't remember this. Amy wrote in her email to me in the first one. She's I think Sarah's probably disappointed that you're already married because she would have liked to be a flower girl or something.
Sarah: I think that is so true. And Amy was right, exactly right on that.
Haley Radke: That's amazing. Okay, are there any similarities that you guys have noticed between either us or me and dad? Anything that's popped up [00:16:00] through the years?
Amy: I definitely notice. Your and dad's sense of humor is really similar, which I think was so fun for me, especially as a teenager, because our dad has always been the really funny one in the household.
And so to see a woman who was also really funny, it was like, oh wow, here's Haley with the same kind of sense of humor. So that was definitely a similarity I noticed between you and dad. And I also really remember loving the fact that we look pretty similar. Because I think mom and Sarah look pretty similar, but I had been the female in our house who took more on dad's side of the family.
And so I just remember being like, oh my gosh, I think my sister is so pretty and we look the same. That's so special when I met you, so that was really nice, I think, to feel like I had this similarity.
Haley Radke: I'm gonna get all [00:17:00] teary. Oh, I wasn't anticipating that. Sarah, what about you? Do you remember any similarities, or even now, like?
Sarah: I definitely do. Even just you and dad on paper, I think if dad was born when you were born, I think it's very possible he would have a podcast about something. Is that inherently? I think our whole family our all of us siblings are very confident public speakers and love reading and writing and are very well spoken and I think that all comes from dad and his, he is so much of that, and that we're all very passionate people.
Also I think that's a huge [00:18:00] similarity between all of us. But I definitely remember something from my childhood. Dad had gotten me a comic book. It was like a treasury of all of the Ziggy comics. I don't think it's a very well known comic series, but essentially, the vibe of the comics is that Ziggy is this kinda odd looking, funny guy, and the humor is all very sarcastic and skeptical, and that Dad loved those comics, and Mom did not.
These comics are horrible! They're depressing! And he had given a book of them to me, and I loved them, and thought they were so so fun and entertaining and I think that [00:19:00] we definitely share some of the like more sarcastic humor and more like deep skepticism like in being funny and I think that's definitely a similarity between us and dad also.
Haley Radke: Do you guys remember one time I came and I wrote little notes on everybody's mirrors or windows I had I on a white, with a whiteboard marker. And because I did it right before we left for the airport, it was like a secret kind of thing. I don't even know what I wrote. I don't know.
Just cutesy little notes, I'm sure. And y'all thought dad had done it because our writing is so similar. And he's a lefty. I don't understand how handwriting is genetic, but do you remember that?
Sarah: I absolutely remember that and being shocked to learn that it was you that [00:20:00] wrote the note on the board and just being like, wow, like, how is that even possible that your handwriting is so similar?
Haley Radke: It was just such a funny thing. I, yeah, I was like, what? I don't, I didn't understand that you guys would think it was him because why would he write, I don't know, the whiteboard marker. Okay. Can you think of any surprises for you in terms of our differences? I remember when I met you guys were vegetarian at the time.
And I know Dad had written that in an email, but I didn't act like that was for, I thought he was being joke around about it. I didn't understand that. No, you guys were in fact vegetarian. And it was a huge deal because when we visited. He made a steak when we came. Do you remember that?
Amy: I do remember that and it was a really big deal that dad was making steak. It was the talk of the town for a week before you guys came.
Haley Radke: Scandalous. [00:21:00]
Sarah: I think for me the biggest thing was knowing that you weren't Catholic.
Haley Radke: Oh.
Sarah: That was a huge deal because even though you were Christian, the vast majority, especially at that point in my life as a nine year old, we were in Catholic homeschool groups and very Catholic circles to the point where all of my best friends were Catholic and their families were Catholic and some of them had wayward older siblings who weren't Catholic anymore, right?
Which was a huge deal and I knew that at the time that was just a really big deal. So I remember, I think after maybe the first visit or something, having a conversation with mom about it. And me being [00:22:00] concerned about you because you weren't Catholic, which is so funny now, I'm like, oh boy, I'm very deep in that.
Haley Radke: I even worked at a church at the time I was, all in evangelical Christianity. You couldn't get more Christian. I'm like,
Sarah: 100 percent. But I think at some point you wore black nail polish and that's really concerning behavior.
Amy: I remember that. I remember the nail polish.
Haley Radke: What?
Amy: Yes, that was very edgy for us. We were like, whoa, she wears black nail polish.
Sarah: Yeah, we were not allowed to wear black nail polish which is so funny.
Haley Radke: Oh my gosh, I didn't know. That's good. I'm sure there was other scandalous things I did that I did not know were.
Amy: Also remember you had a streak in your hair, like you had a pink streak. [00:23:00] And that was also edgy. We were like, whoa, she dyes her hair a different color. But I was gonna say, the difference that I remember was, I think, maybe your first visit when we had family game night. And our family is very loud, there's lots of trash talking, there's lots of hype and excitement, and it is a big deal, we're very competitive.
And I remember, Haley, that you had to leave the table, because it was too much for you! And, I just re I was so surprised, because this was normal to me. This is how you play games. And so the fact that it was too much for you, I couldn't understand.
Haley Radke: Oh, I remember that. It was Monopoly. And it was so intense. And I am actually a very competitive person. I'm sure I've told you guys this game before, this story before, but I remember playing this game [00:24:00] with this other couple and it was, it's called Ticket to Ride. I'm sure lots of people have played Ticket to Ride and you have to build these pathways to other cities.
And there's only so many ways you can get to a city, and if you don't make it there's a big point penalty. And we were playing with this other couple, and the wife had a meltdown, because her husband took the last track that she needed to win the game. And she had a temper tantrum in front of us, and, we were in our early to mid twenties at the time, and I was just like, this is the most embarrassing thing I've ever witnessed.
I'm never gonna be this again. I cannot be this competitive. It is not that serious. I still remember it. It was yesterday. Anyway, so I really toned it back on the competitiveness. So when you guys were playing Monopoly like it was real money and you were gonna actually be like so wealthy when you [00:25:00] won this game, I was so torn because that is my nature is to be, but I couldn't trash talk my new sibling.
I wasn't going to get in there. Like it was like a very I can't alienate you in the beginning. And this is I can't, I've never seen a family act this way, which I know lots of families do. This is how game night is at my house now. Like my kids are just the same as super competitive as you guys were, are.
Yeah, I remember that. It was, I didn't know what to do. And I had left and I felt so awkward about it. It was bad. Yeah.
Amy: Oh, I could totally see that. You don't want to trash talk the new family that you're trying to win over in a way.
Haley Radke: The kids?
Sarah: Yeah.
Haley Radke: The kids? I was an adult. I'm gonna trash talk Sarah? No. But you guys were super into it. Into it. Oh my gosh. And now Monopoly is Isaiah's favorite game. And I [00:26:00] always win. And he still wants to play. I don't know. Can you give us the practical, like, how have we stayed connected over the years as you've grown into, young adulthood now.
Now you're, I don't know, can I even say young adults anymore? I don't think so. You're just adults.
Amy: I feel like I'm too old for young adults.
Haley Radke: Okay.
Sarah: Young adults.
Haley Radke: Sarah, you can be a young adult, but not Amy. Okay. Yeah. From emails to what have we done over the years to keep in touch?
Amy: I think it's definitely evolved over time. At the beginning it was emails and then I think there definitely were some years where we didn't end up talking as much and then it's evolved into more texting and more phone calls, and then as I've gotten even older, visits, either you visiting me, me visiting [00:27:00] you. So I would say it's changed because my life has changed so much since I was 12 when we met, right?
Sarah: Yeah, I think same for me, in terms of emails, even just having each other on Instagram and being able to respond to stories and seeing each other's, life updates in that way and I think we don't talk right now as much as we realistically could. We do intentional phone calls every now and then, but it's not a regular weekly communication between the two of us, but it also, to me, feels very much like my relationships with Amy and Daniel also in that, oh, it's the phase of life, and it's, there's so much love there, even without a weekly update and [00:28:00] check in, right? And I know, in the future, that will also evolve into a season of talking more, or less, or whatever that looks like.
But it feels like a pretty average sibling connection to me, where there's a big age gap. Like it just feels so normal of yeah, there's not constant communication. And also this is just kind of relationship when one of you is in school and the other one just graduated school and the other one is an adult with kids.
Haley Radke: With almost a teenager.
Sarah: Literally.
Haley Radke: Yeah. I do appreciate how y'all roast how old I am. That's good.
Amy: This is making me think. I'm almost the age that you were when we met. And that's crazy because in my head you were so old [00:29:00] and I do not feel that old right now.
Haley Radke: It doesn't help that I was married. That just makes you feel older anyway, right? It's oh, you're a real adult.
Amy: Fair enough.
Haley Radke: Even though I got married when I was 20, okay, let's go to the hard. Do you think of what's the most difficult thing that's been, has there been things difficult for us to navigate or any particularly super challenging times?
Amy: I think post reunion initially was pretty tough for me because as I said, I had to re know and discover about who my dad was and what my family was. I even remember going to summer camp that summer and one of the classic questions you're asked is, how many siblings do you have? And I was like, three, it used to be this easy question and then all of a sudden I felt stuck.
And so that was a really tough time and I think, I know the adults all went to therapy, you and Nick and mom and dad, the adults all went to [00:30:00] therapy and it would have been awesome in hindsight if I had been brought into the therapy because I think that I was really going through a rough time and that all of the dynamics and the different boundaries that were put in place with communication, which were super helpful for the adults, were really tough on me.
And so it would have been just so nice if, I had the one, piece of advice to give people in reunion. It's don't leave anyone out. Everyone is going to be affected by the reunion, and if you're doing therapy, everyone needs to be included.
Haley Radke: Oh, I love that. Yeah, that's a good one.
Sarah: I think for me, because I was so young, I don't think I went through any difficult periods with it, but I do remember there was an emotional weight around the rest of the family, and that for a certain amount of time [00:31:00] Mom and Dad were really going through it, and, were in therapy and were working through things, but that I had no idea what they were working through.
There was, like, I think, in many ways, the communication could have been better, and maybe, like Amy said, it realistically would have been helpful for me to also go to a therapist. And to have some maybe mediated conversations about what was happening. But I just remember in my head, you were my sister and that was really exciting and good but that mom and dad are really not okay and having a difficult time with something which, even as an adult, what's funny is that I'm like I have no idea what was going on. I [00:32:00] still don't know what the therapy, between all of you was and what was addressed, and I have no idea, and I definitely think it was really difficult to know that there was this huge emotional thing going on, that half of the family wasn't okay, and that I had no concept of what was happening, and I think there could have been some extra communication to dumb it down to a nine year old's level, almost, right?
Of I think I needed something to have a better idea of what was happening, to feel more secure, I think, because there definitely was a time period where I just knew the family did not feel stable.
Haley Radke: Amy, do you know what the adults were all fussing about?
Amy: I do, and I [00:33:00] did know at the time, which I think was tough almost in a way that I knew. I know, Sarah, you're like, oh, I wish I would have known. But see, I did know, and then that made me worried, I think, for the adults. So yeah, I was privy to what was going on, which was tough. It was just a tough situation. Reunion is hard. There's no easy, there's no easy answer or path or system.
Haley Radke: I'm trying to think about what you would have thought were the issues. Even in my mind, I'm like, what did we talk about in therapy? I know we talked about having rules of how many communications and it was very much like trying to right size their relationships into more normalcy. That's what I remember and I had [00:34:00] Isaiah, pretty soon into reunion and so it was like, oh, now I have a kid and it's what are you going to be in terms of what is grandparenting going to look like? And that's the stuff I remember. Sarah, is that what you remember, Amy?
Amy: Yeah, no, that's what I remember, and I think those rules surrounding communication were what was really hard on me, because, I mentioned earlier, you were this older person who was all of a sudden a support for me and interested in me, and I was a pretty shy kid it was a really big deal for me to have someone like you in my life.
And then, with the communication rules, it blocked off our relationship. I wasn't supposed to have private emails back and forth anymore between you and me. And it was like, all of a sudden, it's oh, here's the this person had been brought into my life and then all of a sudden was taken away.
And I remember sharing that. I did [00:35:00] share it. And was then told, explained why the rules were put in place, but I think what I got from that situation was then like, okay, what I need doesn't matter I'm not a priority here, we need to do this for the sake of the adults and the dynamic, and I got that but it was like a big heartbreak for me.
It was very painful, I think especially because the introduction of you into our lives had created a lot of pain and struggle for me internally and then I got used to it and got close to you and that was like, oh and upheaval again.
Haley Radke: That's really hard.
Amy: Yeah, and I have so much grace for the adults involved so much grace. Everyone was doing their best. It was a really hard situation everyone was doing what they thought was best right and as an adult, I totally understand that.
Haley Radke: Yeah. Aww. Little Amy.
Amy: I know, right? Poor little 12 year old Amy. Aww. [00:36:00] Yeah.
Haley Radke: Okay. Now you can grade me. Let's talk about, I disrupted the birth order. Daniel is no longer the oldest. I'm the oldest by so many years, apparently, like decades. For the listeners, you can grade me on big sister duties. As someone who grew up as an only child, how am I doing as a big sister?
Amy: You're doing great as a big sister. I absolutely love having you as a big sister. I often tell people how grateful I am that you came back into our lives because I missed out on you when you were younger and when I was younger and so the fact that I get to have you in my life is just incredible. You've been such a support to me and I think the age gap, which I know you love when I bring up, works out to be really cool for me because I have this person who does have more life experience than me and you can be a support for me.
And there was one particular time [00:37:00] about three, four years ago now that I went through a really bad breakup and Haley flew out to come see me. She flew out for the weekend and we spent an Airbnb weekend together and traveled around and the amount of support and love that I've gotten from you has just been so meaningful for me. I can't picture my life without you.
Haley Radke: That's so nice. Thank you. Sarah?
Sarah: I think you're doing great on older sister duties.
Haley Radke: Older sister.
Amy: You called yourself that. You can't complain.
Sarah: I'm so sorry, but you are older than me. I don't know.
Haley Radke: By so much. I know.
Amy: Sarah, don't double down.
Sarah: If it helps, I also call Amy my older sister. You are both older than me.
Haley Radke: Oh, she's very old. Yeah.
Amy: Ancient, one would say.
Sarah: Yeah, I think it is [00:38:00] also been so lovely for me to have you a part of our lives. There were definitely many years that I was not close with Amy. While we were living together, we really did not, grow closer until after high school and after we were both moving out and starting to make our own life choices, which is, I feel like, very common for siblings.
And I think that because you never lived with us, we always had that relationship. Of there was no underlying tension and fighting about who's cleaning the bathroom that week, which meant that you've always just been a supportive role and that you have always just been a comfortable big sister that I could talk about with different things [00:39:00] and that you were older was also a blessing to me, too.
There was one period when I was, I think it was the summer when I was in grade, maybe going into grade 8 or 9, that I had come to stay with you and Nick for a few weeks after
Haley Radke: I had surgery. And you were helping because I couldn't pick up the babies.
Sarah: Yeah, which to me was the best thing ever and it was so special for me to have a safe place outside of my family that was also my family.
Of this isn't my house where things are, there's different things going on always with the other siblings and mom and dad and it was such a safe haven for me to be able to have family who I loved [00:40:00] that, yeah, were able to, support me and be there for me if at that time, my mental health was so not good and I remember having so many beautiful conversations, and us hanging out, and having girl time, and so many, yeah, so many blessings in that.
Haley Radke: Okay, I'm fine. Everything's fine. What, God, what an honor. I, Okay.
Amy: Sorry I'm tearing up over here.
Haley Radke: I told y'all we're gonna keep it light and fluffy and I'm gonna keep it super professional. That's just, it's a sweet moment. That's nice. What's it like for you having me be a podcaster and talking about adoption for my job now.
Amy: I think it's fun. I'm like, oh, my sister has a podcast. She's big in the adoptee podcasting and adoptee world. [00:41:00] And sometimes I'll tell people to go look up your podcast. They'll be like, oh, send it to me. So I'll send them an episode and they'll listen, which is fun.
Haley Radke: You're helping get me downloads? All right.
Amy: Oh, yeah.
Haley Radke: That's pretty good.
Sarah: I think it is so wonderful and I am always so proud to talk about that and share that with people I think a lot of you know the very Christian spaces that we were in growing up, many of them very much, I heard a lot of messaging growing up that was, adoption is the answer, it prevents abortion, and therefore, it is fantastic.
And I've had conversations with many of my friends and different people in my life, and I'm always so happy to share that this is not a perfect solution. [00:42:00] This is not a perfect answer and that there are, many flaws and difficult things and lifelong impact to adoptees and I feel so proud as a sister that this is something that you went through that had a huge impact on you as a person and your life and so proud that you share your story with people and that you have created a beautiful space that you needed when you were 20, like I am so proud of that and really just think it's the best thing ever.
Haley Radke: Oh, thank you. Amy, have you have your thoughts on adoption changed over the years from either from me or listening to the show? I know you used to listen for a while. I don't know [00:43:00] if you ever listened, Sarah, but
Amy: I did. I used to listen as I was falling asleep.
Haley Radke: Happy to serve you to dreamland.
Amy: My thoughts on adoption have definitely changed over the years. When we first met, as Sarah said, I was just hearing the Christian messaging of adoption is this beautiful, good thing and everyone should do it. I even remember, like, when I was maybe 11 just before I met you I went through a phase where I wanted mom and dad to adopt a baby.
I was like, mom, you and dad should adopt a baby. Yeah I was fully bought in to adoption and so I think, I've really appreciated getting to hear all the complexities about adoption, and I often talk about people, talk to people about the grief that goes along with adoption, and I've felt that grief, right?
The grief of missing out on knowing you for so long, and so [00:44:00] my thoughts on adoption have definitely changed. I'm no longer yes, adoption is always good. And I see the grief and heartbreak on the side of the biological family and for the adoptee and all of the mental health issues that go along with the trauma of being relinquished at birth.
Haley Radke: So I guess I've radicalized everyone. Excellent. My master plan has all come into fruition.
Sarah: I think as a very young person, like I would say probably as a 16, 17 year old, from knowing your story and having limited understanding of everything I knew at that point that I was like, okay, adoption will never be an option for me.
That if I got pregnant, [00:45:00] I would never place my child up for adoption, which I think, obviously there's a lot of privilege that comes with that in that I know I have family who would support me, I have a lot of financial support, but I do think that's significant. And that, for me, I've known for a long time from having you a part of our lives that I was like, that would never be an option.
Haley Radke: Wow, thank you. Thank you guys for your candor. I really appreciate you being willing to share today. It's just been so lovely to hear all these memories and stories and I have tingly love feelings in my body. It's so nice. Do you have any last thoughts, advice for people, especially for people who have kids in reunion, like you shared some things today like I literally had not thought of, and I [00:46:00] feel silly that I didn't. Even those things are helpful advice, but any last thoughts that you want to share? With folks.
Amy: I think I would just reiterate what I said before that adoption really affects everyone. Reunion really affects everyone and I've had to process through my own grief and my own feelings and I think that if you are in reunion and you have kids.
Take everyone to therapy. I'm certainly biased because I'm in school to be a psychotherapist right now but family therapy is really helpful. So take your kids to therapy. It's gonna have an impact on them and I would say that it's gonna impact everyone differently. I know our brother was impacted very differently than I was and I was impacted very differently than Sarah was, and so everyone's gonna have really unique needs in this situation so spending time to, as best as possible, support each person in whatever they need is awesome.
Haley Radke: Thank you. Sarah?
Sarah: I think I would just say that, [00:47:00] are we, is it 14 years? 14 years out, I think we're all doing really well, and I know I am so grateful to have Haley a part of our lives and I just would give hope to anyone that's in the trenches of processing with a new family that there's so much hope and so much work went into that on all sides. But, that I'm so happy that you were brave enough to send that first text to Dad.
Amy: Sarah, you're so sweet. You're such a sweet person. I love your optimism and everything. That is so true.
Haley Radke: Aww. I have loved being a big sister and have worked really hard at it. And it's just been [00:48:00] truly such an honor to watch you both grow up and Daniel too.
And he's got his own little family now and to get to be there for The milestones, the breakups, the weddings, the babies it's just been just amazing. Yeah, thank you. Thank you both for sharing. I know it's not easy to be public but welcome, welcome to the public podcast.
Amy: Thank you for having us. It's an honor to get to be on your podcast. That's such a special thing.
Sarah: Yeah, absolutely. I'm so happy that we were able to do this and so happy to be able to share a little bit of our side of that journey.
Haley Radke: Aren't they amazing? Our brother is equally as amazing and we had this just really special conversation. [00:49:00] Even once we had finished recording, we stayed on and chatted about how powerful it was to unpack these things and like really have a good discussion about them. And we talked about some heavier topics as well, but I just thought, wow, like how, miraculous that after all these years and all the work that everyone put in that we've built this beautiful connection in all its variations.
So now I get to be an auntie. And I have a sister in law and I'm going to be gaining a brother in law shortly. And we're reaching all these milestones and I'm watching my sisters decide on their careers and pursue them. And it just, it's just so cool to be at this new stage of life together. And if we hadn't put the work [00:50:00] in, I don't know.
Where we'd be, we wouldn't be connected. So I do hope that this does bring you hope, like Sarah said. I hope that this celebratory conversation was a happy moment that you could share in our joy. And God, I really, it was really special to bring them to you. And I hope you enjoyed this conversation as much as I did.
And I told Amy and Sarah when we were done, I'm like, even if this never went to air, this was just like the best. Here it is for you. Thank you for celebrating 300 episodes with us. And I know I've been telling you about this. I'm working on this brand new project. It is, it's all happening, and you'll be hearing more soon, but there's so many good things happening to be excited about, and advancing adoptee [00:51:00] advocacy and family preservation and lots of good stuff.
So thank you for listening. Thank you for celebrating 300 episodes with me. I still can't really believe it. That's a lot of episodes. That's a lot of talking. So, I'll just say goodnight, Amy. Hopefully this helped you fall asleep and. There's humbling moments, right? It was overall so sweet, but it's come on, you know what?
Tell me in the comments, does anyone else fall asleep to our conversations? I have my sleep podcast too. So it is a compliment. I hope you laughed with us and enjoyed, thank you so much for listening. Let's talk again soon.
